May 15, 2008
Toward a more effective definition of “accountability” for men.
Accountability isn’t just weekly meetings with a “partner.”
It also means having friends who’ll punch your face when you need them to.
Subscribe to 22 Words
Recent Comments
Sponsors
Categories
- Arts in General (24)
- Bible (67)
- Blogging (158)
- Brevity (25)
- Constructive Criticism (271)
- Faith (217)
- Food & Drink (63)
- Language (226)
- Literature (112)
- Love (93)
- Miscellanea (308)
- Movies & TV (27)
- Music (171)
- parenting (158)
- Personal (191)
- Questions (258)
- Quotes (41)
- Recommendations (132)
- Sports (14)
- Technology (2)
- Uncategorized (9)
- Visual Art (36)
- Writing (57)
Archives
- September 2010 (9)
- August 2010 (88)
- July 2010 (116)
- June 2010 (79)
- May 2010 (89)
- April 2010 (62)
- March 2010 (21)
- February 2010 (25)
- January 2010 (32)
- December 2009 (47)
- November 2009 (63)
- October 2009 (45)
- September 2009 (40)
- August 2009 (40)
- July 2009 (40)
- June 2009 (37)
- May 2009 (47)
- April 2009 (51)
- March 2009 (40)
- February 2009 (31)
- January 2009 (44)
- December 2008 (47)
- November 2008 (54)
- October 2008 (50)
- September 2008 (41)
- August 2008 (45)
- July 2008 (51)
- June 2008 (51)
- May 2008 (66)
- April 2008 (74)
- March 2008 (71)
- February 2008 (19)
Reader Recommendations
Some of the books and music that you, the readers, have recommended here over time:
Twitter Recommendations
Theme based on Derek Punsalan's Grid Focus.
Amen
Love it. Love it. Couldn’t have said it better myself. I, like I suspect of most men, should be punched in the face more often by men who love me. Did I say “more often”? The last time I was punched in the face was sixth grade, and I didn’t punch back – it was very traumatic (I, like you, carry a man bag). But your point is taken. We men need to be more direct and confrontational – perhaps not with a punch to the jaw, but certainly with stern words and a firm shaking by the shoulders. We need to say more often to each other, “What – are – you – doing!!??!!??”
Yes, thank you. Mark Driscoll would certainly agree.
But how would this work for Anabaptists?
good call!
The problem is this is a degree of friendship that the MySpace generation seems largely incapable of. We swim in sea of surfacey friendships and week-long relationships. How can we embrace the faithful blows of a friend when we define “friend” by someone who would never do that?
I recently posted a video that’s a helpful “punch in the face” sometimes. I know that I need to be punched more often!
http://thepratts.wordpress.com/2008/05/11/how-to-counsel-peoplethis-is-dedicated-to-my-dad-one-of-the-best-counselors-i-know/
Totally. Your real guy friends are the ones you have a few agreements with that start with “Please kick me in the… if I…”
I think Sam makes a good point, or a good challenge. I work with the high school ministry at my church, and it’s terribly abnormal for any of the students to have punch-in-the-face-love relationships. The girls are one big support group who never say anything harsh to one another’s faces and the dudes are, at best able to converse at a cognitive level only, or at worst not able to converse at all. I attribute this largely to too much media interaction and not enough interpersonal interaction, thus leading to a severe lack of good butt kicking, face punching accountability.
Wow. That is EXACTLY how I would have said it.
I’m happy to hear that, Frank.
[...] Great Thoughts On Accountability Jump to Comments Click here. [...]
Thanks,
I’m going to direct my accountability partner and our High School guys accountability group to this entry!
Personally, I think “accountability” is this generation’s excuse for zero to less than zero mentorship. I can hold my bro “accountable” for not doing this or that, but I haven’t walked a few miles beyond him to be able to show him how to avoid the potholes like older, saltier Christians should be able to do. Mentorship is the mothership – not accountability.
Amen Abraham. Now we’re talking.
Better is open rebuke than hidden love. Prov. 27:5
Faithful are the wounds of a friend. Prov. 27:6a
And I agree, Sam makes a key point. The falty definition of “friend” is connected to the falty definition of “love”. If we think that anything and everything that challenges me or makes me feel uncomfortable is “unloving” – we’re in trouble.
My-comfort-centered-me-centered theology will reject the teaching of the wise and miss the loving discipline of the Lord, even when it comes through true, loving, “friends”.
As a youth pastor for 10 years, I saw it alot, and not only in the young – also in many parents.
“You’re only young once, but you can be immature for a lifetime.”
Too many men can’t take a punch.
“Faithful are the wounds of a friend;
profuse are the kisses of an enemy.”
I think that Nathan is on to something. Has accountability replaced mentorship or discipleship from the older men in the church? I think that the older men in the church have to be an example to the younger men and take an active role in guiding younger men.
Or else you often get something like this exchange:
“Dude, you’re sinning.”
“Yeah, I know.”
“Bummer.”
TRUE!
Too often “accountability groups/partners” just makes everyone feel more comfortable about their sin. They start thinking “Oh I feel so much better hearing I’m not the only one struggling with this, it can’t be that bad, right?”
Too bad there aren’t more friends willing to punch each other in the face.
Abraham –
Now here’s the kicker, mon dude: if that’s true, and a true friend is willing to punch you in the face when you need it,
Is it ever appropriate to use sarcasm and satire in our blogging as carriers of the gospel?
I agree that mentoring is the “mothership” — well said.
I also know that if I were ever to step out of God’s desire for my relationship with my wife…I have a good 5-6 guys who would hunt me down and give me the “faithful wounds” I need. I praise God for them!
Yup. I think we need more ‘ow’ in fellowship.
I’m trying to change from a ‘people-pleaser’ to someone who feels comfortable confronting my mates.
We have a great word in Australia – ‘mateship’. It’s about loyalty and friendship in a shared situation, such as a war.
[...] sons. he works at desiring god ministries. i follow this blog pretty regularly). the post, “toward a more effective definition of ‘accountability’ for men,” which is a pithy reflection on what real accountability between men ought to look like, [...]
[...] drugs, binge drinking 'normal' for teensWho's Your Daddy – 13Training New LeadersPunch your face accountabilityLost and foundHilton's in BorobodurDale on FootyThe WordPress PodcastMatt Chandler [...]
Frank,
How well would you receive sarcasm and satire as a means of correction from a friend?
Steve
Steve –
My friends are Phil Johnson and Dan Philips, so I think you should consider that it’s not “would I” receive that criticism, but “when I do”. I receive it, and I give it — when it is necessary.
When I do, I consider the source, because I really do believe that a punch in the face from my friend when I deserve it is better than a pat on the back from my enemy in any circumstance. [Prov 27:6, TeamPyro paraphrase]
I think you can’t endorse Abraham’s statement here in theory, but then when your friend actually does punch you in the face — with his fist, with a word, with his fellowship, etc. — start saying, “yeah but”.
The only “yeah but” is “if I deserve it”. After that, play on. Play the ball and not the man.
Let a righteous man strike me—it is a kindness; let him rebuke me—it is oil for my head…(Ps 141.5)
[...] Toward a more effective definition of “accountability” for men. Posted May 20, 2008 Taken from post at 22 Words: [...]
Frank,
I’m glad sarcasm and satire works for you. I assume that you feel the same way about mockery since you and your friends engage in it so often. I, for one, want a firm and carefully worded rebuke to communicate both love and truth that leaves no doubt of either.
Steve
Steve –
So you think Abraham is wrong, then? “having friends who’ll punch your face when you need them to” is not a necessarily-godly way to engage other men?
I’m curious because I am 100% certain that there are popular bloggers and ministries who think TeamPyro does a bad thing in the way we frankly criticize and satirize those with whom we disagree when they deserve it. If you’re in that camp, I’d like to engage you on that issue specifically, using this comment thread as a jumping-off point.
Frank,
I agree wholeheartedly with Abraham’s post. Are you suggesting that anything less than satire and sarcasm is insufficiently confrontational?
I would argue that the type of accountability that Abraham is describing does not happen in the public sphere. It doesn’t happen in blog posts. Its goal is not humiliation. It is correction that leads to repentance and faith.
Steve
[...] Toward a more effective definition of “accountability” for men. – 22 Words. [...]
[...] Toward a more effective definition of “accountability” for men. – 22 Words. [...]